Thread
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Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 1999-12-30T06:04:03Z
Current votes are: (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., Michael, Tatsuo (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy open bracket on if () line: (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026 -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Theo Kramer <theo@flame.co.za> — 1999-12-30T07:47:19Z
Bruce Momjian wrote: > > Current votes are: > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > Michael, Tatsuo > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > open bracket on if () line: > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will > modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. Don't know if I qualify to vote - but if I do then I vote for 4-space tabs (seeing that I often read the code - now if only two-space tabs were an option...) -------- Regards Theo
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
J. Roeleveld <j.roeleveld@softhome.net> — 1999-12-30T08:14:00Z
> > Current votes are: > > > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > > Michael, Tatsuo > > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > > > > open bracket on if () line: > > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > > > Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will > > modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. > > Don't know if I qualify to vote - but if I do then I vote for 4-space tabs > (seeing that I often read the code - now if only two-space tabs > were an option...) Same here, I prefer 4-space tabs as well, looks much better on standard screens. Also I personally prefer the open bracket not to be placed in the if() line. But I'm not sure if I qualify to vote either, although I do read the code. Joost Roeleveld
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Stephen Birch <sbirch@ironmountainsystems.com> — 1999-12-30T13:00:58Z
I would also vote for 4 space tabs. But would prefer 2 space tabs. Steve Theo Kramer wrote: > Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > > Current votes are: > > > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > > Michael, Tatsuo > > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > > > > open bracket on if () line: > > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > > > Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will > > modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. > > Don't know if I qualify to vote - but if I do then I vote for 4-space tabs > (seeing that I often read the code - now if only two-space tabs > were an option...) > -------- > Regards > Theo > > ************
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us> — 1999-12-30T15:11:00Z
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> writes: > Current votes are: > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > Michael, Tatsuo > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > open bracket on if () line: > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. It looks to me like there is consensus to change the tab spacing (which is NOT the same as the logical indent step, for those newcomers who don't seem to be aware of the difference). However, I don't see a consensus to change the bracket layout. 7-to-6 is not enough of a margin to justify a wholesale code change. Especially considering that my original vote was NO, which Bruce chose to interpret as YES ;-). Change it back to NO, and the vote is the other way. I think what we have is a consensus to change the physical tab spacing but leave the look of the code alone... regards, tom lane
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 1999-12-30T17:01:29Z
Vote is for changing tab size. Indentation will stay at 4 spaces. > Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > > Current votes are: > > > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > > Michael, Tatsuo > > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > > > > open bracket on if () line: > > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > > > Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will > > modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. > > Don't know if I qualify to vote - but if I do then I vote for 4-space tabs > (seeing that I often read the code - now if only two-space tabs > were an option...) > -------- > Regards > Theo > > ************ > -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 1999-12-30T17:01:52Z
Vote is for changing tab size. Indentation will remain at 4 spaces. [Charset iso-8859-1 unsupported, filtering to ASCII...] > > > Current votes are: > > > > > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter > M., > > > Michael, Tatsuo > > > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > > > > > > > open bracket on if () line: > > > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > > > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > > > > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > > > > > Unless someone else speaks up, I will consider this vote closed. I will > > > modify pgindent to reflect this format the next time it is run. > > > > Don't know if I qualify to vote - but if I do then I vote for 4-space tabs > > (seeing that I often read the code - now if only two-space tabs > > were an option...) > > Same here, I prefer 4-space tabs as well, looks much better on standard > screens. > Also I personally prefer the open bracket not to be placed in the if() line. > > But I'm not sure if I qualify to vote either, although I do read the code. > > Joost Roeleveld > > > ************ > -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 1999-12-30T17:09:24Z
> Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> writes: > > Current votes are: > > (8) 8-space tabs: Tom Lane, Peter E., Massimo, Jan, Hiroshi, Peter M., > > Michael, Tatsuo > > (5) 4-space tabs: Bruce, Andreas, Vince, Vadim, D'Arcy > > > open bracket on if () line: > > (7) yes: Massimo, Peter, Vince, Tom Lane, Peter M., Marc, Tatsuo > > (6) no: Bruce, Vadim, D'Arcy, Jan, Hiroshi, Michael M. > > > Looks like radical change will come to our source code format for 7.0. > > It looks to me like there is consensus to change the tab spacing (which > is NOT the same as the logical indent step, for those newcomers who > don't seem to be aware of the difference). > > However, I don't see a consensus to change the bracket layout. > 7-to-6 is not enough of a margin to justify a wholesale code change. > Especially considering that my original vote was NO, which Bruce chose > to interpret as YES ;-). Change it back to NO, and the vote is the > other way. > > I think what we have is a consensus to change the physical tab spacing > but leave the look of the code alone... OK, change tab to 8 spaces, keep indent at 4 spaces, and keep open bracked on a separate line. Got it. -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us> — 2000-01-03T07:05:20Z
Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not > matter what tab setting one is using. Quite a good thought, actually. It'd be worth checking to see if there is any material expansion in the source's disk footprint and/or the size of a compressed tarball after getting rid of tabs entirely. I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... regards, tom lane
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> — 2000-01-03T07:08:41Z
> OK, change tab to 8 spaces, keep indent at 4 spaces, and keep open > bracked on a separate line. Got it. Just a couple of comments: istm that an 8-5 vote should not be interpreted as a "consensus", at least not until you get those 5 to agree that the proposed change is acceptable. Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not matter what tab setting one is using. - Thomas -- Thomas Lockhart lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu South Pasadena, California -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Hannu Krosing <hannu@tm.ee> — 2000-01-03T23:00:50Z
Tom Lane wrote: > > Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: > > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would > > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not > > matter what tab setting one is using. > > Quite a good thought, actually. It'd be worth checking to see if there > is any material expansion in the source's disk footprint and/or the > size of a compressed tarball after getting rid of tabs entirely. > I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... Me too! And, there already is an utility to entab/detab in tools section, so people can use it if they absolutely must have tabs in their source. AFAIK most decent editors also can [en/de]tab the source they are editing. So my vote would be 4-space indents, no tabs -------------- Hannu
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Jan Wieck <wieck@debis.com> — 2000-01-03T23:18:54Z
Hannu Krosing wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > > > > Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: > > > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would > > > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not > > > matter what tab setting one is using. > > > > I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... > > Me too! Count me in. Jan -- #======================================================================# # It's easier to get forgiveness for being wrong than for being right. # # Let's break this rule - forgive me. # #========================================= wieck@debis.com (Jan Wieck) # -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 2000-01-03T23:59:02Z
> Hannu Krosing wrote: > > > Tom Lane wrote: > > > > > > Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: > > > > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would > > > > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not > > > > matter what tab setting one is using. > > > > > > I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... > > > > Me too! > > Count me in. Do I need to tabluate a vote on this too? I have to get all new votes from everyone on: 8-space tabs no tabs Indentaion is still 4-spaces. I prefer the 8-space tabs to no tabs. Seems like 8-space tabs won over 4-space tabs, so we need a vote on 8-space tabs vs. no tabs. I will need new votes because I have not kept any of the old messages. -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Vince Vielhaber <vev@michvhf.com> — 2000-01-04T00:15:18Z
On 03-Jan-00 Bruce Momjian wrote: >> Hannu Krosing wrote: >> >> > Tom Lane wrote: >> > > >> > > Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: >> > > > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would >> > > > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not >> > > > matter what tab setting one is using. >> > > >> > > I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... >> > >> > Me too! >> >> Count me in. > > Do I need to tabluate a vote on this too? > > I have to get all new votes from everyone on: > > 8-space tabs > no tabs > > Indentaion is still 4-spaces. > > I prefer the 8-space tabs to no tabs. Seems like 8-space tabs won over > 4-space tabs, so we need a vote on 8-space tabs vs. no tabs. > > I will need new votes because I have not kept any of the old messages. Ok, this is probably a really dumb question and probably even been answered before but I missed it. Why not make a tab be a tab and however it appears in the end programmer's editor can be up to the programmer? Or is pgindent changing tabs to spaces? Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com http://www.pop4.net 128K ISDN: $24.95/mo or less - 56K Dialup: $17.95/mo or less at Pop4 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Marc G. Fournier <scrappy@hub.org> — 2000-01-04T00:21:01Z
I'm for no-tabs personally ... On Mon, 3 Jan 2000, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > Hannu Krosing wrote: > > > > > Tom Lane wrote: > > > > > > > > Thomas Lockhart <lockhart@alumni.caltech.edu> writes: > > > > > Was "spaces instead of tabs" one of the voted-on options? That would > > > > > make the tab issue moot, and would result in consistant appearance not > > > > > matter what tab setting one is using. > > > > > > > > I'd be willing to vote for this if the space penalty is not large... > > > > > > Me too! > > > > Count me in. > > Do I need to tabluate a vote on this too? > > I have to get all new votes from everyone on: > > 8-space tabs > no tabs > > Indentaion is still 4-spaces. > > I prefer the 8-space tabs to no tabs. Seems like 8-space tabs won over > 4-space tabs, so we need a vote on 8-space tabs vs. no tabs. > > I will need new votes because I have not kept any of the old messages. > > -- > Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle > maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 > + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue > + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026 > > ************ > Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
D'Arcy Cain <darcy@druid.net> — 2000-01-04T02:18:47Z
Thus spake Bruce Momjian > I have to get all new votes from everyone on: > > 8-space tabs > no tabs > > Indentaion is still 4-spaces. > > I prefer the 8-space tabs to no tabs. Seems like 8-space tabs won over > 4-space tabs, so we need a vote on 8-space tabs vs. no tabs. Seems like multiple votes. First vote is whether to use spaces or tabs for indenting. Then, how many characters should we indent if we use tabs and if we don't. Note that people may have different opinions on how much to indent for each of these. I suspect a number of people choose 8 space tabs because it is standard and consistent on different methods of output, not because they particularly like that much indentation. I know that I have lately been considering going to 3 space, no tab indenting in my own code so that it looks right whether I use the editor, cat to the screen or print it. -- D'Arcy J.M. Cain <darcy@{druid|vex}.net> | Democracy is three wolves http://www.druid.net/darcy/ | and a sheep voting on +1 416 425 1212 (DoD#0082) (eNTP) | what's for dinner. -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
D'Arcy Cain <darcy@druid.net> — 2000-01-04T02:22:44Z
Thus spake Vince Vielhaber > Ok, this is probably a really dumb question and probably even been answered > before but I missed it. Why not make a tab be a tab and however it appears > in the end programmer's editor can be up to the programmer? Or is pgindent > changing tabs to spaces? Not a dumb question at all. However, think about comments. Look at this example. i++; /* This variable is being incremented. I am commenting * * this because it is such a stupid variable name */ Under my editor that comment lines up nicely but it will look cockeyed for many people reading this because I used tabs instead of spaces and my tabs are 4, not the usual 8. -- D'Arcy J.M. Cain <darcy@{druid|vex}.net> | Democracy is three wolves http://www.druid.net/darcy/ | and a sheep voting on +1 416 425 1212 (DoD#0082) (eNTP) | what's for dinner. -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Marc G. Fournier <scrappy@hub.org> — 2000-01-04T02:35:49Z
On Mon, 3 Jan 2000, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote: > Thus spake Bruce Momjian > > I have to get all new votes from everyone on: > > > > 8-space tabs > > no tabs > > > > Indentaion is still 4-spaces. > > > > I prefer the 8-space tabs to no tabs. Seems like 8-space tabs won over > > 4-space tabs, so we need a vote on 8-space tabs vs. no tabs. > > Seems like multiple votes. First vote is whether to use spaces or tabs > for indenting. Then, how many characters should we indent if we use > tabs and if we don't. Note that people may have different opinions > on how much to indent for each of these. I suspect a number of people > choose 8 space tabs because it is standard and consistent on different > methods of output, not because they particularly like that much > indentation. I know that I have lately been considering going to 3 > space, no tab indenting in my own code so that it looks right whether > I use the editor, cat to the screen or print it. I tend to prefer 2 spaces to using tabs myself ... Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
D'Arcy Cain <darcy@druid.net> — 2000-01-04T05:10:30Z
Thus spake The Hermit Hacker > I tend to prefer 2 spaces to using tabs myself ... Two seems a little too small to me although I have been considering three for some time. -- D'Arcy J.M. Cain <darcy@{druid|vex}.net> | Democracy is three wolves http://www.druid.net/darcy/ | and a sheep voting on +1 416 425 1212 (DoD#0082) (eNTP) | what's for dinner. -
Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Bruce Momjian <pgman@candle.pha.pa.us> — 2000-01-04T05:23:48Z
> Thus spake The Hermit Hacker > > I tend to prefer 2 spaces to using tabs myself ... > > Two seems a little too small to me although I have been considering > three for some time. Four is a nice 1/2 multiple of 8, the standard tab size. -- Bruce Momjian | http://www.op.net/~candle maillist@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
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Re: [HACKERS] Source code format vote
Vince Vielhaber <vev@michvhf.com> — 2000-01-04T10:25:39Z
On Mon, 3 Jan 2000, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote: > Thus spake Vince Vielhaber > > Ok, this is probably a really dumb question and probably even been answered > > before but I missed it. Why not make a tab be a tab and however it appears > > in the end programmer's editor can be up to the programmer? Or is pgindent > > changing tabs to spaces? > > Not a dumb question at all. However, think about comments. Look at > this example. > > i++; /* This variable is being incremented. I am commenting * > * this because it is such a stupid variable name > */ > > Under my editor that comment lines up nicely but it will look cockeyed > for many people reading this because I used tabs instead of spaces and > my tabs are 4, not the usual 8. Good point. I'm looking at it in pine right now and it's not too well lined up. Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com http://www.pop4.net 128K ISDN: $24.95/mo or less - 56K Dialup: $17.95/mo or less at Pop4 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ==========================================================================